Wounded deer recovered

[dale clawson]

My son Barry shot a nice buck after taking a doe, expending the three rounds he had in his rifle, then discovered he had lost his extra ammo walking in. The buck dropped as the 300 Win. Mag. softpoint hit him, but showed signs of recovering, so he beat a hasty retreat to the house for more ammo. When he returned the buck was gone. We searched and found a little sign, but not enough blood trail to follow, then dark fell and the search was abandonded until the next day. We took our Greman Shepard the next morning and the dog finally located the deer about half a mile away. The deer was still active and showing some fight. The land owner for the property the deer had traveled onto had given us permission to look for the deer, but didn't want us to take a gun, so we were happy to see the deer head back to where we could use a rifle( he was hit low on the shoulder with the bullet blowing up before penetrating into the vitals). After pushing the deer back onto our lease, we were able to locate him in head high grass with the dog and put him down. Old "Duke" earned high praise andsome choice cuts, as without his help, we undoubtedly would have lost this one. Made my point that even whitetails require a deep penetrating bullet sometimes, and you never know when that might be, so always use it. Dale

[versifier]

Please tell us more about the soft point bullet he was using. Weight, brand, range, etc. I like to keep aware of what was used when I hear about that kind of bullet failure. I shoot mostly cast now, and generally rely on Sierras when jacketed are called for, though I do load Noslers (for moose and deer) and Win FMJs (target only!) for several different people. I am always being asked about different brands and styles of bullets and how they perform on game. Swapping experiences on this and other fora I think has helped a lot of people to make more informed choices in hunting bullets and resulted in fewer wounded deer. I know that there are several specific big name bullets that many have reported failures using, despite their reported accuracy. One or two reports might be operator error, but multiple failures show clearly where there are design problems that need to be addressed.

Nowadays, most bullet makers will tell you the optimum velocity range for their hunting bullets, and as long as you don't push them too fast or too slow, and you know their speed at given ranges, it greatly lessens the chance of bullet failure. In a magnum round, a bullet chosen for its accuracy might be for instance too fast and blow up until 150yds, optimal out to 350yds, and too slow to expand beyond 350. Or your -06 bullets might be tack driving accurate on paper from your rifle to 600yds, but won't expand well in game beyond 200. That kind of information is not always easy to get regarding factory ammo, unless the specific bullet is available as a component.

[obssd1958]

Dale and Versifier,

There is a thread on Cast Boolits http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=10503
that is along these lines.

If you read it, you'll find that I am also VERY interested in bullet performance - having not recovered a bear that I shot 3 times. Unfortunately, I could not use my cousins bear dogs to aid in the recovery. The IDFG won't allow the use of dogs while the general big game season is under way. Congratulations on recovering the deer Dale, and Thank You for the effort!!

The bullet that I was using was a factory loaded RP 165gr core-lokt in 30-06. I chose that load because it groups 1/2 to 3/4 inch at 100 yards in my model 700. The distance was 165 yards - Nikon rangefinder. Shot placement was centered between the shoulders on the first shot, behind the right front shoulder on the second shot, and center of the body (aiming for the spine @150 yds) for the 3rd shot that hit him. All shots had visible impact.

Searched for 2 days... not a good deal...........

WON'T shoot factory loads again - and next time I will be using the best bullet I can find, based on research like this thread and working up loads that my gun likes.

My .02 cents...

Don

[dale clawson]

It was a Rem. Cor-lockt 165 gr. and the range was about 125yds. I had offered him some 220 gr. nosler partition reloads but he chose not to use them since he had sighted in with the 165 gr. The deer was about 200 lbs., 18 in. inside spread with good heavy beams, 8 pt. with one brow tine broken off to leave it a 7. Dale

[versifier]

Thanks Dale. That makes about twelve strikes on that bullet. The .30 cal 150 & 180 C/L don't rate too high either, especially out of magnum cases, but some of the failures were with .308 & -06. Interestingly, the blunt 150's & 170's that they load in the .30-30 seem to do really well. I also have a lot of positive comments on the .25 cal C/L out of .250Sav & .257Rob. This seems to say to me that they perform best out of medium capacity cases at moderate velocities.
Truthfully, my shoulder would also be a little hesitant about any .30 cal 220gr bullet , but any of the NPT's in 150, 165, 180, (or even that 220 I suppose) would have been my choice over the C/L. For deer, Sierra GK's in 150 & 165 have worked great for me in .300Sav, .308, & -06, but there have been some reported failures of them with magnum cases, too. As much as I hate shelling out the cash for premium bullets, they seem like cheap insurance if you are shooting magnums at anything but very long ranges, and even then they still make good sense.

[Ranch Dog]

Thanks Dale. That makes about twelve strikes on that bullet. The .30 cal 150 & 180 C/L don't rate too high either, especially out of magnum cases, but some of the failures were with .308 & -06. Interestingly, the blunt 150's & 170's that they load in the .30-30 seem to do really well.

I think these couple lines of your text says it all. A bullet has to be designed to fit a given range of velocities and with the 30-30 this is a pretty simple task as the bullet is going to fit one caliber. The 165-grain Core-Lokt (bullet number is R3006B) was designed with the 30-06 in mind and is only offered in that caliber in factory ammo. The 308 and 300 SAUM have 165-grain bullets in the Remington factory ammo but they are not the R3006B bullet.

I take it that the original bullet discussed was a handload in the 300 WM? Of course, this doesn't explain the performance obssd1958 detailed...

[dale clawson]

The ammo used was factory loads 300 Win. mag. says corelockt on the box. Bought at Bass Pro in Fort Lauderdale, Fl.

[MT Gianni]

Versifier, You can call it 13. I hit a mule deer buck 5 times with 165 gr core-locs and the '06 while he stood there. This was 1989. He was then shot again and walked off. Range was about 175 yrds across a canyon. I found him dead but none of the bullets penetrated through the lungs with most blowing up inside the rib cage. A dead animal is not normally bullet failure but no bases were present just general lead particles and jacket pieces. This was the major factor in my becoming an reloader. Gianni.

[versifier]

That's odd. Usually they fail because they're pushed too fast and/or the game is too close. I've heard of more than one failure like you describe, but with a .300mag and within 50yds. Your experience sounds like the kind of failure you get hunting with hp match bullets, though I know it obviously was not. Still one for the books, though. Still, I only consider them suitable for practice, and mil pulls are even cheaper (I hunt with 150 Sierra GK's), so that's what I normally go with.